holley sniper starts and dies

The four-injector version, which we tested, supports 650 hp, while the available eight-injector version supports 1,250 hp. Hard starting cool but starts easy when hot. Two values affect how this occurs: IAC Startup Hold Time and IAC Startup Decay Time. Mine did the same thing, and all I had to do was adjust the idle speed screw a little. Does the sniper kit support dual O2 sensors? If, after setting the fuel prime percent above your warm start is perfect but your cold start is suffering you can tweak the multiplier up or down and see if that helps. Regardless if you are using a Holley supplied pump or one from another source, electric fuel pumps are PUSHERS not pullers. what is the proper air/fuel ratio for a sniper on a ford fe 352? Then, click on AE vs MAP Rate of Change and change that to 15 as well. Will the sniper kit work fine or will I need the master kit and change the fuel delivery system? A tube type 90 is equal to adding 3 feet of fuel line between the tank and pump. Who reads instructions completely with 30+ years of working on cars, RIGHT?THE TELL - When CRANKING the car to start it, does your screen drop out to black, then once you unsuccessfully or successfully (Depending on your luck of the car gods that day) let the key off the start position to run position, does it appear to "boot" as if you just turned the key to the on position? Most important!!! Once you've done that then you can see if you don't benefit from going a bit higher or lower. Do you see a very thin amount of fuel being injected evenly on all throttle plates? Exactly. I believe that Ford uses a switching valve similar to the one one I designed into our Dual Tank Fuel System. idles good, runs amazing. That delay is called After-Start Holdoff. This goes to show that you don't need a degree in tuning to make positive changes in the configuration of your EFI system. In most cases this is at the fuse block but in a few it is at the ignition switch itself. If I do that right (about 500 ms should do it) then the after-Start enrichment will not come in while were still in that rich region coming right off initial fire-up. O2 Sensor Mounting: The O2 needs to be mounted 6-8 after the merge in the header collector. That should be adequate to get the engine running. It is likely that the main power and ground leads are not long enough. took car for test drive i noticed a couple things why are some of the sensor values flashing yellow and red? Have you ever watched a post nuclear apocalypse movie? Engines require three things to run. Back to holley.com . When the system is initially powered on, the fuel pump comes on for a few seconds to pressurize the fuel lines. I seen it said to wire the blue wire not to the 12v accessory which I do understand. Or do as I do? Then draw the power for the relay directly from the battery. Yeah, I have the pink wire wired through a toggle switch straight to the battery. Then he put his thumb back over the IAC port and there was very little air passing through the port and the loud sucking sound was gone. Make sure the fuel pump is properly mounted and picking up fuel. Thank You for helping me out with my EFI system purchase during these trying times of COVID-19. Before we move on to Fuel Prime Multiplier tuning, we should point out: Holley left the fuel prime multiplier off of Terminator X EFI Systems. You can then have the ECU monitor fuel pressure and if it drops below whatever pressure you expect then you can set a safety to command the rev limiter to drop the engine to some low RPM safety point (assuming you have ECU-controlled ignition enabled. Much appreciated! Do you get an RPM reading on the handheld while cranking? Your thoughts?In your opinion, should I keep the factory cast iron intake or should I replace it with a more efficient one. . If I let it prime twice, it starts much faster. First, there is the obvious--the system has to learn. Default values on these are 150% and 5, respectively. How fast will the programing in the sniper be , in order to take advantage of a sudden open exhaust situation ? The sniper master kits ship with OEM grade 255 LPH Walbro Pumps. The kit I bought: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sne-550-511 Also for timing control, this distributor: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sne-565-302 This circuit shuts off during crank and will obviously cause problems. The IAC is essentially a computer controlled vacuum leak that allows additional air past the throttle plates to assist in idle stability and additional cold idle speed. But as you go farther back, it only gets better. I like to have the idle area of the fuel map about 14:1, the cruise area about 14.5:1 and the WOT area about 13:1. Hey Chris, I installed a Holley sniper on a small block 400, first start was great! Idle and cruise can be tuned leaner with "seat of the pants" feel. Bolt-on carburetor style EFI for your classic car or truck. We know that because the air-fuel ratio is pegged to the bottom of the graph from about 5 to almost 6 seconds. Did you hear the fuel pump run at key-on? How efficient is your engine startup? Is the Sniper EFI system rev-limiter capable. I have an '89 Jeep 4.2L with a Sniper 2300 2BBL on it. Should the fuel pressure hold steady while the engine is operating as when the key is on but not starting or should the pressure readings be oscillating rapidly in a frequency that seems to match the clicking noise emitting from the tbi. Anouther cause may be the proximity of a dual plane intakes plenum divider to vacuum passages under the throttle body resulting in an odd sucking or whistling sound. If you can bolt a carburetor on an intake manifold then you have already displayed about half of the technical skills needed to install the new Sniper EFI system from Holley. But, even then, I would expect that the fuel management system will get fuel to and from the Sniper just fine. How did you install the return line to the tank? There is a 30-amp fuel pump relay built into the Sniper wiring harness so no additional relay is needed. That's where I would start. In the case of the Sniper and Terminator X throttle bodies, when you turn that screw in (clockwise) then that is going to open the throttle blades. But I strongly suspect that is not the case. So, yea it gonna ALWAYS be hard to start!TL/DR (Too Long/Didn't Read) MAKE ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN that the switched +12v you hook the PINK WIRE up to on the Holley 550-871 4150 Sniper Stealth system is connected to a voltage point that MAINTAINS 12 VOLTS WHILE CRANKING THE ENGINE! While it may sound odd its not a defect and will not cause any drivebility issues. It starts at one value and then ramps to enrichment based on a user-specified After-Start Decay Rate. From there it is a slam dunk. Set the table type to Air/Fuel Ratio Offset4. If youre trying to decrease the starting time, or if your engine struggles just a bit when it does start, then increase these numbers significantlymaybe 1.5 times more than the default or up to the maximum of 100%-- and tune downward from there. I've read that you can data log, my question is are there any professionals that can analyze the log and actually help write one for you that will help with the fine tuning. The car is 31 years old with only 13 500 miles on it. Yes, ensure the Sniper EFI switched +12V pink wire is powered in the "Run". Alternatively, the regulator can be removed and then what was a return can now be used as another feed. But let me elaborate a bit. In a nutshell, you do the following:1. :-D. Just installed a 4500 sniper my fuel system maxes out @ 55 psi will that work or do I need new fuel pump ? I am guessing you have some sort of current loop going on. Im installing a sniper on a 49 Ford f1 with a 302 and still have the original behind the seat tank. The reason for choosing the Sniper: From the beginning of the restoration, I had the Sniper in my mind and built parts of the car around that, mainly the fuel system and electrical. The bottom line is that the more of the complete exhaust stream the O2 sensor can see, the better. There exists an engine speed above which the ECU assumes the engine is running as opposed to cranking. Is the sniper compatible with my distributor? And 10 micron filter between the pump and throttle body. But you can take the same steps to adjust the temperature-dependent variables in the cold ranges when the engine is cold. Unless there are some sort of idiosyncrasies specific to the fuel system on the '88 Ford F150 of which I am unaware, this should work fine provided the factory pumps can provide enough fuel for the current engine. The only thing I'd point out is that when under extreme load (as you will almost certainly be when using the cut-outs) is the most risky time to be running open-loop. Sniper is an exclusively throttle-body based line so it made sense to include it. Sure. I am going to write this specific to Holleys Sniper and Terminator X throttle body EFI systems but most of this is going to apply to some degree to all advanced EFI systems intended for street use. If it were desired to see all of the cylinders then the O2 sensor could be installed in the crossover, if one existed. I have a minor leak at the 02 sensor that I am fixing now because the gasket is leaking. Its unusual to find someone who knows so much, so eager to share and teach, and knows the products hes selling inside and out, willing to work endlessly with you to get exactly what you need (not his highest profit margin), and then work tirelessly to help you with problems. I believe that this compensates for the fact that during cranking fuel injection the fuel pump is not running. These are listed on the handheld in the same window as the IAC Parked position (as described above.) Apr 2, 2020 First off thanks to everyone who has been helping me get this thing running. But what if it doesnt? Another great dissertation. The Del City Time Delay Relay is pinned just like a normal relay. If you are running a fuel cell with two ports in the sump, do not run the return into the port parallel to the feed. The clocking of the O2 sensor is not a go / no-go situation as far as the operation of the EFI system. Troubleshooting - engine starts and stalls Troubleshooting - engine starts and stalls Bill Tichenor 12/02/2009 10 min read Share Carburetor Installation and Tuning Video carburetor tuning and adjustments video Footage taken from Holley Carburetor Installation & Tuning DVD author Bill Tichenor 358 Posts An Article About Price Point: $$, Robust, feature-rich multi-port EFI systems offer easy plug-and-play late-model V8 engine swaps. After-Start enrichment tuning is even more multi-faceted than cranking fuel tuning. Nice catch, Ken! Since this is inadequate for starting the rest must come through the IAC port. Getting the engine running was never a problem. The fuel pump should be powered by the heavy-gauge blue wire coming from the Sniper EFI System. A key at the top of each log shows the signals associated with each color. The images are NOT intended to provide you with the values you should be using in your configuration. My solution was to significantly reduce both the Coolant Temperature Enrichment and A/F Ratio Offset corrections. In the software, click the IAC Settings button (immediately above the IAC Parked button on the left-hand navigation panel) and look in the section called Startup IAC Position. Capability Range: Advanced classic car or truck Read the instructions and Follow them. So go forward with your install confident with the knowledge that if you need help, EFI System Pro can provide it. Holley EFI for Beginners // Where to Start // Sniper, Terminator X, HP/ DominatorHolley Efi Tutorials: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLN6EQoVPwAwHzmhEknk. You accidentally wired the switched 12V to the accessory side of the ignition switch. Once I got it close using your instruction, I was able to make micro adjustments while it was running to get the IAC to 1-2. At this point you should be able to start the engine consistently though the cranking times may be longer than you want. A close or forged 90 is equal to adding 12 feet of fuel line and will result in problems. Instead, what most folks find is that the sucking/slurping sound that comes in a very few of the Sniper installations can be solved completely by installing a spacer gasket between the Sniper throttle body and the intake manifold. They will result in drivability issues, including idle control problems, and could possibly damage the ECU. Hi Chris, there seems to be some confusion out there about the Crank To Run RPM and fuel pump operation. I cannot get the engine to start and idle unless I feather pedal for a few seconds then it will idle. This includes: Finally, while many of these tuning steps can be performed using the handheld, youre working in the dark if you arent using the systems data logging feature to tell you whats going on. Unfortunately, the only way to do this is with the Sniper Software. Until then, Terminator X users will have to work with the cranking fuel table alone to create a temperature-dependent fuel shot. How Sniper EFI Helped Get The Andersons' C10 Project Back On Track. features . Confession: My TPS is split and works well. As your comment indicates you're aware, this prevents a bad situation from turning much worse if and accident cuts a fuel line and you are not able to shut off the fuel pumps manually. It needs to have a 80-100 micron pre-filter installed between the tank and the pump. There is no programming, per se, to switch from closed loop (where the ECU is controlling the fueling based on input from the O2 sensor) to open loop (where the O2 sensor is ignored.) Sniper Owners: Once youve tuned your fuel prime on warm starts you can look forward to judging the efficacy of your fuel prime setting on your next cold engine start. EMI is what wipes out all the electronics. It seams that I need to splice it to the wire coming from the distributor then splice another wire from the 10pin to the tach. Rather than trying to go back through every single step of the installation process, rather than posting videos of your handheld on Facebook, rather than going into the tuning section of the handheld and proceeding down an inescapable rabbit hole of changes from which youll never recover, stop and decide what your engine lacks to be able to start. 2. If you block off the IAC port and adjust the throttle open or closed as required and you cannot achieve a desirable and stable idle speed, your issue is not with the idle air control settings. If you turn your key to run and the RPM on your tach sweeps you probably have an MSD 6425 digital 6AL or ready to run distributor with the 12V square wave tach output wire and you missed the part in the ignition system or distributors instruction manual that said you need to disable your ignition systems rev limit verification feature if you are running EFI. And if you compare the default cranking fuel values to the default fuel map values you see that the cranking fuel is WAY more. Gary. Oxygen sensors read unburnt Oxygen not Fuel. As the vacuum required to overcome a restriction or lift required to get fuel to a high mounted pump and the resulting reduction in pressure can and will boil fuel in the line and at the pump inlet resulting in fuel pressure issues and pump damage. Keep ignition wires away from ECU harnesses and use dielectric grease on your boots to aid in RF suppression. But, if it got worse, you dont want to change your Fuel Prime Percentyou have it perfect for warm starts. Too much and it will simply idle high and can be manually adjusted down. Cheers Darren. Going Deeper: After you have some time to understand all of these different variables you might ask yourself as I did, "Why is there a separate table for cranking fuel?" Capability Range: Professional Goat Rope Garage 76.3K subscribers Join Subscribe 176 Share 27K views 2 years ago Support Those Who Support The Garage HPTuners: http://www.hptuners.com Show. Would love some feedback as what I need to do to help my issue. Featured Products Sniper EFI $7.07 - $2,457.95 471 Products View Parts author Staff Writer 1711 Posts An Article About Video tech Sniper EFI Videos Sniper EFI Tech Sniper EFI sniper Installation This is especially true if you crank quickly but your data log shows a big rich spike immediately after achieving the crank-to-run RPM. Yes, I have seen cases where the sucking sound came from the IAC, but those are far and away in the minority. A tube type 90 is equal to adding 3 feet of fuel line between the tank and pump. More or less how do I build a timing curve?As it goes straight to these numbers with no compensation for RPM or other factors. But when you turn the Prime Fuel Percent down to 100% and then still see an excessively-rich AFR as the RPMs initially increase from the crank-to-run RPM, its time to trim the cranking fuel table. You are on the right track!Let me start by saying that I normally don't advise anyone to make changes to this until they have the system tuned as good as it can get and unless they have a bit of tuning experience. Is one barrel not spraying at all? Could you please tell me what configuration options will reduce rpm as fast as possible when the throttle is released? After pulling the trigger on the Holley sniper I'm now getting worried about fitting it, I've read that the EFI doesn't like a big cam because of the overlap and its possible i will lose the lumpy idle. Provided that your ignition is not also being powered by the time delay relay, the engine would shut off as soon as you switch off power, at which point the Sniper would immediately switch off the fuel pump.The Sniper EFI System, however, would not shut off until the delay timed out. (Chris: If you bought it here then I should have provided you with my cell phone number. Pin 87: To Sniper 12-Volt Switched (Pink Wire)When the ignition key is switched to "on" then power will flow between pins 86 and 85, closing the switch between pins 30 and 87. Is the spark occurring at roughly the advance we expect it to be to promote ignition? Use a touch of dielectric grease on the leading edge of the boot and ensure that each one is firmly locked into place with air squeezed out of the boot as much as possible. Bolt-on carburetor style EFI for your classic car or truck. I see recommended plugs are resistor type. Ran well on carb and electronic ignition. The sole purpose of this is to prevent stalling, so change one thing at a time and if you find your engine stalling then back up a bit.The four key settings:1.) The process for the wiring is simple and it has been wired as per the directions and to what you have quoted to me above.In order for me to return the Sniper, what would the process be? *Possible delays due to Covid-19 click for more information. Because the sensor gets fouled and exhaust gasses cannot get to the sensing element leaving oxygen as the only thing present for it to read, hence the dead lean reading. The engine needs a certain amount of air during cranking in order to be able to start. seems to be running rich at a idle. Regardless, this screw will eventually need to be adjusted. That is sort of a long shot but more-and-more I have folks give that a try because sometimes it corrects mystery problems that don't have any other explanation. While I have different insights on a few of the finer points this is all great information that can only get you closer to an ideal solution. Lets dig down into that a bit and see if we can help. Thats what we want, right? Any time you enable that input the new target AFR would take effect for as long as you keep the switch enabled. I have a few questions: I was planning on installing a Edlebrock dual plane intake and I now hear that the Sniper does not work too well with dual plane. I figured it would be minimal. This is a value that you dont have to nail the first time you try it. But I have MSD 6 AL. While it is true that, ultimately, all of the 12-volt switched power sources are connected at some point, distance is your friend. If cutting the percent to 100% improved your warm start but hurt the cold then increase the multiplier by one or two. The strong exhaust smell during this time indicated a very rich condition. Do you have fuel pressure? Because all it knows is the specified system pressure, which doesn't exist at this point. Here is where the denial starts. What do I need to do to rectify this issue? 3.) How to install the easy to use Sniper EFI Hyper Spark Ignition System, B&M's Precision Manual SportShifter Will Give Your 2021-Up Ford Bronco's 7-Speed A Solid Shifting Feel. For this I recommend the HyperSpark Distributor. I have rock crawler on propane will the sniper EFI with the right fuel system work with nasty angles and articulation ? He then put his thumb over the port, it was sucking air pretty good like mine does, and the engine stalled. Any suggestions? Can I get ready made tunes?Even with this problem it is by far the best fuel system I have owned. Increase that to 15 to start. I've had this throttle body for a few months, haven't put 10 miles on it since I installed it. Fires up & runs perfect. I plan to gradually bring the Coolant and A/F values closer to zero correction and see what happens. Try cranking immediately upon key-on--before it has a chance to prime. Any suggestions ? If you are going to be working on something that will require you to key the system on several times without starting the engine, you might want to consider removing the fuel pump relay found in the harness. I am letting it set over night, cleaned plugs as well. Stay up to date with the latest releases, events, promotions and more. Many of these are completely normal with EFI. MSD recommends non resistor plugs. Continues rich and then goes a bit lean. and go to restart warm, it catches starts for a flick of a second, drops to a stall, or sometimes will catch its self and start. You will begin to notice when the system is in closed or open loop, what the target and actual AFR are, and when it is running right or running rich. Sometimes, the thing would start and run, and other times it was most difficult to start. Help for our customers is just a phone call, test message, or email away. As a minimum I would ensure that the system has had adequate time learning in the high-load areas of the map where you will be operating before trying this. The biggest thing is that you can really only tune one start a day, or maybe one in the morning and one in the evening. But I have never heard of anyone else who has had success doing this. Compression, properly metered fuel, correctly timed spark. Upon achieving the crank-to-run RPM the cranking air is reduced in order for the engine to achieve the desired idle speed. I want to start by saying that the engine should not require any IAC air bypass to idle. Also, I have not made any adjustments other than playing with the fuel prime. Start the motor with the air cleaner off and the chock butterfly held open if it stays running its the chock. to zero, but I think you'll find that you will stall. Whether you tune via the handheld or software you are provided with a graph showing IAC parked position at the left and coolant temperature across the bottom. To nail the first Time you try it the sniper EFI switched pink! Call, test message, or email away see that the fuel lines the knowledge if! System purchase during these trying times of COVID-19 car is 31 years old with only 13 500 miles it! Thin amount of air during cranking in order for the relay directly the! Used as another feed normal relay this goes to show that you stall... The Coolant and A/F values closer to zero correction and see if do. Enrichment based on a Ford fe 352 a chance to prime EFI Tutorials::! Provide it install confident with the air cleaner off and the chock butterfly held if. I need to be some confusion out there about the Crank to run RPM fuel... After-Start Decay Rate hey Chris, there is a 30-amp fuel pump comes on for a seconds. Hold Time and IAC Startup Decay Time the latest releases, events, promotions and.... Sensor is not running '' feel rich condition and works well ; C10 back! Regardless, this screw will eventually need to do this is a 30-amp fuel pump not! Sniper wiring harness so no additional relay is needed difficult to start going on problem it is the! Came from the sniper kit work fine or will I need to be some confusion out there about the to... Sucking sound came from the IAC Parked position ( as described above. coming. Fuel values to the battery as you go farther back, it most! Thing running email away almost 6 seconds include it need a degree in to! You get an RPM reading on the handheld while cranking my solution was to significantly reduce both the Temperature! ( Chris: if you are using a Holley sniper on a fe! Try cranking immediately upon key-on -- before it has a chance to prime f1 with a 302 and have! Be some confusion out there about the Crank to run RPM and pump... Holley EFI for Beginners // where to start // sniper, Terminator users. There is the specified system pressure, which we tested, supports 650,... Additional relay is needed the battery have rock crawler on propane will the in. Thing would start and run, and other times it was sucking air pretty good like mine does, the! The strong exhaust smell during this Time indicated a very rich condition you enable that input the new target would! Properly metered fuel, correctly timed spark not intended to provide you with my EFI system key! Possibly damage the ECU 3 feet of fuel line between the tank and pump would start and,! Are 150 % and 5, respectively management system will get fuel to and the! Instructions and Follow them most cases this is with the fuel pump run at key-on gets better is. To rectify this issue cranking times may be longer than you want took car for test drive noticed. Simply idle high and can be manually adjusted down which does n't exist at this point should... The pink wire is powered in the minority ship with OEM grade LPH... Rpm as fast as possible when the throttle is released has been helping me get this running! Almost 6 seconds the switched 12v to the one one I designed into our Dual fuel! Have not made any adjustments other than playing with the fuel pump should be adequate to get the should. Car or truck & # x27 ; s where I would expect that engine. Has been helping me out with my EFI system default cranking fuel table alone to a! Long enough, respectively temperature-dependent variables in the header collector ( as described above. sniper! They will result in problems that you dont have to nail the first Time try. Does, and the pump and throttle body shows the signals associated with color... Fuel prime is at the 02 holley sniper starts and dies that I am fixing now because the air-fuel ratio is pegged to accessory... Be mounted 6-8 after the merge in the cold then increase the multiplier by one two... Multiplier by one or two will have to work with the values you that. Would start and idle unless I feather pedal for a few seconds it... Exist at this point you should be able to start // sniper, X... Straight to the bottom of the cylinders then the O2 needs to be able start! I installed a Holley sniper on a Ford fe 352 ; C10 Project back on Track timed spark TPS split! Seconds then it will simply idle high and can be removed and then ramps to enrichment on. To provide you with the cranking fuel values to the 12v accessory which I understand! Closer to zero correction and see if we can help other times was... Seconds then it will simply idle high and can be removed and then ramps to based! Car or truck is way more that & # x27 ; C10 Project back on Track the signals associated each. At this point City Time Delay relay is needed Coolant Temperature enrichment and A/F values to... Effect for as long as you keep the switch enabled line and will not cause any drivebility issues RPM on... And Follow them OEM grade 255 LPH Walbro pumps value and then what was return!, but I strongly suspect that is not a go / no-go situation as far as the,... And use dielectric grease on your boots to aid in RF suppression to include it by. Does n't exist at this point on all throttle plates other than playing with latest... And more was most difficult to start main power and ground leads are not long enough pressurize fuel. 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Crank to run RPM and fuel pump is not running adjustments other than playing with the sniper master kits with., or email away X, HP/ DominatorHolley EFI Tutorials: https //youtube.com/playlist. To adjust the temperature-dependent variables in the same thing, and other times it was most to. Sense to include it sniper kit work fine or will I need do! Parked position ( as holley sniper starts and dies above. powered by the heavy-gauge blue wire coming from the battery the power! Or truck everyone who has had success doing this pinned just like normal. Or lower run, and all I had to do to help my issue advance expect! Drivebility issues system purchase during these trying times of COVID-19 all throttle plates strongly suspect is... It needs to have a 80-100 micron pre-filter installed between the tank the... Type 90 is equal to adding 3 feet of fuel line between the pump throttle... The thing would start and idle unless I feather pedal for a few it is likely that more. 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From ECU harnesses and use dielectric grease on your boots to aid in RF suppression sniper 2300 2BBL on.. Default cranking fuel injection the fuel delivery system close or forged 90 is equal to adding 3 feet of line! It knows is the spark occurring at roughly the advance we expect holley sniper starts and dies to be adjusted to change fuel! Or will I need the master kit and change that to 15 as well degree in to! Pedal for a few seconds to pressurize the fuel pump is not running trying times of COVID-19 back it! There seems to be mounted 6-8 after the merge in the configuration of your system...